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buckslayr
08-11-2012, 07:24 PM
well boys I just got my Onza 3 back from a winter mimicry dipping,looks sweet, I forgot where about to start to centershot my rest, anybody give me a starting point, thanks

typically8
08-12-2012, 01:45 AM
Mine is to the left of the handle

WildWilt15
08-12-2012, 01:48 AM
Start at one inch and fine tune from there

elkslayer4x5
08-12-2012, 08:56 AM
Most guys say about 7/8", 15/16".

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 12:12 PM
thanks guysI'd also like to know what I should expect for speeds with 28.5 draw,63lbs and 409 gr.arrow.just a loop and 2 xfactor leeches on the sgtring, I'll crono this afternoon and see how it jives with replies, thanks guys,buckslayr

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 01:51 PM
well my pro chrono says 257.63lbs.409gr arrow. ATA is 33.2.brace is 7.25.this seems a little slow to me, what say you all.I just put new strings on it too,wtf

Arrow Splitter
08-12-2012, 02:32 PM
well boys I just got my Onza 3 back from a winter mimicry dipping,looks sweet,
http://home.freeuk.com/jrknight/smileys/postpics.gifUnless we see pictures, it never happened.:D

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 05:24 PM
69786979here you go arrow splitter!

Ehunter
08-12-2012, 07:00 PM
That does sound a little slow to me. Make sure the bow is well tuned to start. Then you might need to sync. your cams, or advance them a little. I figure you should be getting low 270's or so.

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 07:10 PM
my cams are spot on as for as timing,I have no speed knocks on the string, do the originals come with speed knocks,?I can't remember

WildWilt15
08-12-2012, 08:54 PM
That sounds about 20fps slow id say check cam timing.

WildWilt15
08-12-2012, 08:55 PM
That sounds about 20fps slow id say check cam timing.

Oops! didnt see the post before mine lol speed knocks make a HUGE difference they are a must that sounnds like your problem right there.

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 10:05 PM
Oops! didnt see the post before mine lol speed knocks make a HUGE difference they are a must that sounnds like your problem right there.
this is good to know, how do I know where to put them and how many, any help would be appreciated,thanks

themiddleman
08-12-2012, 10:10 PM
my cams are spot on as for as timing,I have no speed knocks on the string, do the originals come with speed knocks,?I can't remember

three speed knocks at each end of the string are going gain you 6 to 8 feet per second

WildWilt15
08-12-2012, 11:31 PM
this is good to know, how do I know where to put them and how many, any help would be appreciated,thanks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiQQOGXNzL8 That video will show you everything you need to know about timing the nitro cam.

buckslayr
08-12-2012, 11:33 PM
I've got the timing gap on my cams right, but now my ATA is 33. and my weight is 67lbs. this is a 60lb bow.If I untwist the string to get my ATA right , my gap on my cams will decrease right??

bfisher
08-13-2012, 06:28 AM
The originals come with speed nocks. Crimp two brass nocksets about 1" to 1 1/2" from the cams. Then shoot it over the chrono to see what you get. Play with the distance from the cam while shooting over the chrono. Might have to add a third nockset. As for the specs, add ten twists to the string and take about five twists out of each cable. This should drop the weight and shorten the brace height. You'll have to adjust the module to get back to the present draw length (maybe 1/2" longer). Don't forget to adjust the draw stop and STS. The cams will advance a little and actually smooth out the draw cycle, too. Let us know how it goes.

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 08:01 AM
well I added the twists to the string and removed them from the cable. that definitely got my draw weight down, but it also dropped my ATA to less than 33".I also have a little bigger gap as far as cam timing.I would say it is a little more than 1/8"from string to post.should I try to get my ATA longer, and if I should, how would I do that. thanks alot fellas.

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 08:48 AM
well i rechecked my timing at full draw and I am about perfect. the top cam might be a skoshe advanced. but any twist of the cable will make it too much.my ATA is still 33.my brace is 7 1/4 and it maxes at 62 lbs.

WildWilt15
08-13-2012, 10:29 AM
well i rechecked my timing at full draw and I am about perfect. the top cam might be a skoshe advanced. but any twist of the cable will make it too much.my ATA is still 33.my brace is 7 1/4 and it maxes at 62 lbs.

Thats close enough to spec to not make a difference mine is 33.75 ata 62 pounds and 7.25 bh but i think my string just stretched a little when i checked it when i first got it i was right on specs.

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 10:53 AM
I just chronoed it. started with 0 speed knocks-254. went to 3 knocks at 1" down. best I could get was 259.I tried 1/2" down all the way to 2" down from the cams.I still must have something wrong.I know it shot faster that this with my other string.

gravedigger
08-13-2012, 01:33 PM
that is a fine looking bow indeed

droppixel
08-13-2012, 01:59 PM
I just chronoed it. started with 0 speed knocks-254. went to 3 knocks at 1" down. best I could get was 259.I tried 1/2" down all the way to 2" down from the cams.I still must have something wrong.I know it shot faster that this with my other string.

If anyone with an Onza could give you the location/length of the nocks on the string that would probably help and speed this up a little for you. I know when I got my string replaced, it did not come back with the speed nocks. I placed new ones on after getting a measurement from Bill. Are they in the perfect spot, probably not ... but close. Won't know until I have a chrono setup that I can just diddle with until it is right.

Ehunter
08-13-2012, 02:50 PM
On my 70# Onza, there are two speed nocks top and bottom each. They are placed 2 1/4 inches from the cam on both ends. On my 60#, there are 2nocks each, and they are 1 3/4 down from the top, and 1 1/8th up from the bottom. The 70#er seems to be the faster shooting bow, all things taken into consideration.
That is a sweet looking bow. Just saw that Mothwing Winter Mimicry for the first time on a bow at a dip shop I went to. Would make a great treestand or snow bow. One of the most beautiful camo patterns I have ever seen.

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 07:18 PM
I'll bet that was my bow, I had it dipped in Kansas,I just got it back.now if I could only get it back the way it was, it was shooting IBO. It must have something to do with my new string.I lost about 20fps. wish I knew where it went.

daiwateampenn
08-13-2012, 07:59 PM
nice bow.. cool color... but i saw alot of throphy hanging inside the room... waoh....

Ehunter
08-13-2012, 08:01 PM
buck, did you have gun870guy from AT do it? If so, I did see it. Amazingly beautiful. Realy looked like a work of art. He ended up dipping my riser and a cam for me. Long story. lol

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 08:09 PM
yea, that is the guy, I felt kinda sorry for him, he had a lot of personnal trauma after he got my bow, he did a nice job though.now if I could only get my speed back, any thoughts.

Arrow Splitter
08-13-2012, 08:12 PM
I'm not sure about your speed problem at the moment, but that's a very cool looking bow.:cool:

A.S

Ehunter
08-13-2012, 08:13 PM
Might try moving the speed nocks to where mine are, and see what happens. I also think you might want to try advancing the cams just a bit.

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 08:33 PM
right now at full draw they are wrapped completely on the mod.I'll try to show pics.69896990what do you recommend?

Ehunter
08-13-2012, 08:46 PM
Need to see it at rest, not full draw, but from the pics, it looks like the cams can stand to be advanced a decent amount. My string comes right off the end of the cam, not part way up the cam like your pics show. Just a matter of twisting the cables up and untwisting the string a bit to get the cable post to cable gap minimized. 69916992

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 09:06 PM
here a69936994re the pics at rest, what do I have to do, I really appreciate this,thanks

Ehunter
08-13-2012, 09:38 PM
Pics of mine at full draw. Looks pretty much like yours, but you can tell my cams are further advanced than yours. 69956996

buckslayr
08-13-2012, 09:47 PM
Okay I twisted the cables and untwisted the string until my gap is like yours, now my specs are ATA 33.24,brace 7 5/16. draw weight 70lbs.these are suppose to be 60lb limbs. should I just turn it down to 63 or what??

Arrow Splitter
08-14-2012, 07:32 AM
Okay I twisted the cables and untwisted the string until my gap is like yours, now my specs are ATA 33.24,brace 7 5/16. draw weight 70lbs.these are suppose to be 60lb limbs. should I just turn it down to 63 or what??
How many twists did you remove from the string, and how many did you add to the cable?

A.S

buckslayr
08-14-2012, 01:34 PM
How many twists did you remove from the string, and how many did you add to the cable?

A.S

I would say I removed 12 from the string and added 8 to eACH CABLE,or close to that.

bfisher
08-14-2012, 01:43 PM
Before we go much further I want to add my $.02. From what I see and your explanation I think you went the wrong way. You added twists to the cables making them shorter. YOu took twists out of the string which made it longer. From the picture I think your cams are highly over rotated and why the draw weight is so high.

You obviously have a shop of some kind at hand and aren't afraid to play around. I would suggest that you take the string and cables off the bow measure them and twist or untwist till you get them to factory suggested length. Essentially starting over. Put it back together and see what you got.

buckslayr
08-14-2012, 02:03 PM
that is easy to do.I think I'll do just that tonight, thanks

buckslayr
08-14-2012, 03:40 PM
well I was going to take all my strings off ansd measure,but I thought I'll shoot it and see how it is, wow, this bow shoots better than it ever has.I turned the lbs down to 63 and chronoed it. still kind of slow, 260, but it really seems to be shooting a tight group.I think I'll try it here for awhile.Will I hurt anything with the limbs turned down to 63 even though they are suppose to be 60lb limbs??thanks

buckslayr
08-14-2012, 04:05 PM
Before we go much further I want to add my $.02. From what I see and your explanation I think you went the wrong way. You added twists to the cables making them shorter. YOu took twists out of the string which made it longer. From the picture I think your cams are highly over rotated and why the draw weight is so high.

You obviously have a shop of some kind at hand and aren't afraid to play around. I would suggest that you take the string and cables off the bow measure them and twist or untwist till you get them to factory suggested length. Essentially starting over. Put it back together and see what you got.

Bfisher, which picture looks like my cam is overrotated.other posts on here said I should advance them . isn't that the same as rotating them.I think I'm confused?

bfisher
08-14-2012, 07:49 PM
The bottom pic in post #33. Looks like the cam could be rotated counter clockwise more. Maybe it's just me, but this might be why the draw weight is so high. Cales are too short and string too long. Although I have 1.5 cams I'll see if I can post some pics of them tomorrow for comparison.

In answer to your last questions, it won't hurt the bow to shoot it at 63#. I ordered a 50# bow this year that actually came through at 54.2#. Being as I only shoot 45# or so I made some major changes to the rigging. I don't worry about factory specs. I set a bow up the way I want it to feel and the heck with the specs. I make my own. They are what they are.

buckslayr
08-14-2012, 08:56 PM
you are right bfisher.I did just that,but I also advanced both cams so the gap was less.you are right in noticing the top cam had a smaller gap than the bottom, this is a great forum, thanks all for help,buckslayr

Spiker
08-14-2012, 11:43 PM
Buckslayr - your best bet would be to just pull all the rigging off and get it set dead on factory lengths.
I think that will put all your specs where they should be.
Fine tuning it after that will only take a twist or two to perfect it.
If you have the correct limbs for a 60# bow and it max's at almost 70# - something is set up wrong.

Ehunter - it may just be the angle of the pics / lighting or whatever but - just from the pics - your cams dont appear to be in time at all.
Look at the distance from the cable to the outer hole in the cams. Also where the cables are resting in the mods.
Again - it may only be the photos that make it look off...

Ehunter
08-15-2012, 04:33 AM
Spiker, I think it's just the angle of the photos. The string comes off the cams at the same place on both at full draw. The cables lay across the same spot on the mods at rest as well. My bow was hanging cockeyed when I took the pics. They weren't the best pictures. lol

buckslayr
08-15-2012, 06:54 AM
Ley's say I was to pull all my strings off and measure them, how would I go about stretching them to get the right specs, thanks

bfisher
08-15-2012, 06:57 AM
Here are some pics of my 1.5 cams showing how I have them oriented. What I did was took twists out of the cables and added twists to the string. Notice how the string comes off the cam straighter. While were into terminology I call this advancing the cams. Two bows exactly the same and a2a and brace height are within 1/16" of factory specs. Also, on the module side notice that the string passes over the the module between the 1st and 2nd hole. Moving the orientation like this makes the bow feel a little smoother on the draw. Only other modification is to move the module and draw stop where I need them.

buckslayr
08-15-2012, 09:26 AM
OK, I took my strings off and string was right on at 56.75. 1 cable was 38, 1 was 37 7/8. that is probably from my twisting to get cams timed.I might have stumbled on my speed problem.I looked at my old strings and they have 22 strands in the string and 18 in the cables. The new set I put on has 24 strands of 452x in all of them, could this make the difference.If so approx. how much speed could I lose.I hope this is the problem??Who do you guys recommend to build me a set of new strings if this is the problem?

bfisher
08-15-2012, 11:00 AM
I hope that was a typo. 7/8" difference between the cables would mean the cams could never have been even close in sync. I honestly don't think the number of strands or the material would amount to such a speed drop. Maybe a few fps but not what you are experiencing. If your old strings were factory then they were most likely BCY Trophy as that is what Martin is using. It's supposedly a little faster than 452, but it's very marginal.

As for who I'd recommend for s string maker? Well, being as I've had a few custom strings I'd have to recommend Hutch. His seem to be as good as anybody I've tried, and I'm picky. I'm very pleased with the string Hutch made for my Nemisis.

buckslayr
08-15-2012, 11:06 AM
I hope that was a typo. 7/8" difference between the cables would mean the cams could never have been even close in sync. I honestly don't think the number of strands or the material would amount to such a speed drop. Maybe a few fps but not what you are experiencing. If your old strings were factory then they were most likely BCY Trophy as that is what Martin is using. It's supposedly a little faster than 452, but it's very marginal.

As for who I'd recommend for s string maker? Well, being as I've had a few custom strings I'd have to recommend Hutch. His seem to be as good as anybody I've tried, and I'm picky. I'm very pleased with the string Hutch made for my Nemisis.

thanks, it was a typo.I am wondering also if my haveing the riser and limbs dipped would change any specs. the limbs did go into the cups pretty tight. anyway, thanks all for the help,

archerx7
08-15-2012, 12:24 PM
To answer your original question, the center shot on mine is 15/16" but I'm still using the TRG so that will have some effect on center shot.

Not too sure about the other issues you are having though, with the string/cables at the correct lengths......DW should be +/_ about 1-2#s of the spec listed on your bow, did you check peak DW prior to disassembly ?

I don't think your speed lose is due to the new string set, 24 strands of 452X is the same diameter as 22 strands of Trophy and a 24 strand 452X string will actually weigh slightly less than the same string made of 22 strands Trophy, if all serving specs are kept the same. I didn't lose any speed when i built the 452X set for my Onza.

You may want to look at the cams and how well they fit in the limb forks and how freely they rotate, could be if the dip was slightly thicker than the factory finish, the cam bearings have a bit more pressure against them not allowing them to rotate as freely as they did before. Speed nock locations should be, 3 at each end starting at 14 7/8" from the end of each loop.

buckslayr
08-16-2012, 09:39 AM
I checked my cams and they rotate freely. the dipping might have caused a tighter fit in the limb pockets and stuff, still doesn't make sense on the speed loss. like I said I was getting in the low 270's before.It seems the only real difference is the strings.If it didn't shoot so good I'd put the old strings back on and check it.I'd rather have it more accurate, than fast, if I can't have both.