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View Full Version : 3 blade vs 4 blade



boobowbender
08-26-2012, 07:18 PM
i know slick trick claim 4 blades have more cutting surface, but i see walmart sells mx 3's for 20 bucks but no mx 4's. is there really any difference or is it all marketing hype?

Money Man
08-26-2012, 09:55 PM
4 blades would have more cutting surface, but, they would also have more surface area that needs to get through the hide before it can start doing damage.

Ehunter
08-27-2012, 04:23 AM
One other thing I have noticed in shooting broadheads, the fewer the blades, the better the blood trail. While Slick Tricks have always punched a pretty good sized hole for me, a 3 blade like Wasp/Muzzy or Shuttle T's tend to leave a little bigger hole. The hide on an animal tends to gap open more the fewer slices that are put into it. I think the only exception to that is with heads like Magnus, Phat Heads, etc., that have the small bleeder blades. They cut a wider slice with the main blade, and still gape open very well.

peace
08-27-2012, 08:10 AM
I have found with the muzzy's that the 3 blade is a bit easier to tune than the 4 blade MX's. Just personal experience, your mileage might vary.

elkslayer4x5
08-27-2012, 08:23 AM
I have found with the muzzy's that the 3 blade is a bit easier to tune than the 4 blade MX's. Just personal experience, your mileage might vary.

My mileage did'nt vary, have always found the 4 blade more difficult to tune. Begining with the bleeder blade for the old Bear Razorheads that I used on aluminum arrows back before screw-in inserts, had to cut off part of the ferrel, because it filled the slot that the bleeders went in.
Bye the way, Peace, my first target weight recurve was a Bear Tigercat, another bow I regret trading. :)

boobowbender
08-29-2012, 02:23 AM
slick tricks may be the problem im having trying to tune then? bout four inches off at 20.

Ehunter
08-29-2012, 04:32 AM
I've always had good flight from Slick Tricks. Are you sure there's no wobble at all when you spin them? I used to roll(spin) check mine, but didn't always see when there was just a very slight wobble. Once I started spinning them as they hung from a strong magnet, it made a differene. You can feel any wobble at all. Even got some that I an feel wobble in, but it's not enough to affect their flight.

bfisher
08-29-2012, 06:57 AM
I've always had good flight from Slick Tricks. Are you sure there's no wobble at all when you spin them? I used to roll(spin) check mine, but didn't always see when there was just a very slight wobble. Once I started spinning them as they hung from a strong magnet, it made a differene. You can feel any wobble at all. Even got some that I an feel wobble in, but it's not enough to affect their flight.

Therein seems to be where most of the problems arise----broadhead alignment. Tuning for broadheads can be very frustrating at times and the fault isn't always that of the broadheads. Those little blades on the front act like wings an catch air as they fly. Whichever way they catch air is going to create a greater force and steer the arrow off course.

First we have to start arrows that are spined properly for the bow's draw weight and draw length, and arrow length. This is where tuning comes into play. Arrows that are underspined are going to be real trouble, flying all over the place. Arrows that are too stiff will be better, but tend to shoot larger groups as the distance increases. Simple tuning procedures, including adjusting the bow's draw weight can improve flight. Don't get caught up in having to shoot a bow at a givn draw weght. Those limb bolts can be your best friend.

It's best to build your own arrows and careful attention to details is what it's all about. Such things as squaring the end of the inserts can help. I honestly think that because carbon arrows have a seam the spine can vary around the shaft creating havoc with broadhead flight as the arrow do bend coming out of the bow, If the seam (stiff side) isn't aligned consistently from shaft to shaft arrow flight can vary. The best ways to find the stiff side is to use a spine tester or float the shafts in a bath tub. How many guys do this? Nock fit on the string is one that very few people pay any attention to. If nocks are too tight it affects arrow flight, even with field points.

How many guys actually spin test their shafts? This should be done prior to arrow assembly and then checked afterwards. It's no secret that carbon arrows are not always straight. There are almost always a few in a dozen that need to be culled out of the batch because of inconsistencies in straightness and need to be removed from the good ones. Then there is spinning after assembly to ensure the broadhead is aligned with the shaft. It's not important that broadheads align with the fletching, but for consistency I like to have them all oriented to the same position. Just for this reason I do not use any of the super glues to install inserts. I like to use 24 hr epoxy so that I have time to align the blades after fletching the shafts.

Then, of course, there's the question of 3 blades, vs 4 blades. From experience I've found that it's easier to get 3 blades tuned than most 4 bladed heads. Cutting diameter plays a roll. The less surface area the easier it gets. That, for me, means a broadhead less than 1/1/4" diameter. A big 2" hole in the wrong place doesn't do much good.

So in conclusion, it's all these attentions to the little details that one must consider and be learned over time. Just how much a person wants to learn and excel is a personal matter.

bob cooly
09-12-2012, 10:29 AM
I think the rise in mech. broadheads is related alot to people not being willing to spend some time tuning their bows. I start with a bare shaft tune and progress through a walk back tune and have no trouble getting either the Muzzy MX4 or my Magnus Buzzcut 4's tuning on two different bows. What I have found is the Muzzy's tend to not tune well if your spine is too stiff. Shoot 400 GoldTips with the Muzzy and 340 Axis arrows with the Buzzcuts. Both bows are in the 48-52lb range with 29" draw and arrows cut to 29"

Tosi
09-12-2012, 02:00 PM
I'm reading allot of you prefer the 3 over the 4 blade. This is just my experience; I've changer from the 3 blade WASP to the Slick Trick Mag 100g and the Razor Trick 100g. What a difference on Elk and South west Mule Deer. If your bow is timed and tuned the broad-head needs little to no adjustment. I just harvested a Mule Deer with a Razor Trick 100g and the shot was spot on @ 80 yards and the Deer went 15 yards. The shot went though the liver then the shoulder on exit. What a blood trail. I've harvested severely Elk and Deer over the last few years with Slick Trick and all of them were great exit holes and blood trails. For me this works, but you need to have your set up spot on. With the Razor you can see were the slice marks are, plus it a cut on contact.

bfisher
09-12-2012, 03:14 PM
I'm reading allot of you prefer the 3 over the 4 blade. This is just my experience; I've changer from the 3 blade WASP to the Slick Trick Mag 100g and the Razor Trick 100g. What a difference on Elk and South west Mule Deer. If your bow is timed and tuned the broad-head needs little to no adjustment. I just harvested a Mule Deer with a Razor Trick 100g and the shot was spot on @ 80 yards and the Deer went 15 yards. The shot went though the liver then the shoulder on exit. What a blood trail. I've harvested severely Elk and Deer over the last few years with Slick Trick and all of them were great exit holes and blood trails. For me this works, but you need to have your set up spot on. With the Razor you can see were the slice marks are, plus it a cut on contact.

I believe you but the first sentence in Bob Cooly's post explains a lot of the problems. Either lack of knowledge or just plain lazy. The question gets asked a lot about which broadheads shoot like field points. The fact is that almost all of them will if the bow is set up well enough. This may take time and few are willing to take that time. These are the days of instant gratification with no work involved. Life just doesn't work that way.

Ehunter
09-12-2012, 06:03 PM
Amen Barry. It takes me several hours to assemble a dozen arrows, not counting fletching them. Cut them, (if bareshaft, cut some off both ends), square both ends, clean both ends inside and out, check insert fit, check for wobble with a broadhead, align broadhead with fletchings and glue inserts in and spin test with broadheads, install nocks or pin nock bushings depending on arrow. Not a speedy process.

Tosi
09-13-2012, 04:22 PM
I believe you but the first sentence in Bob Cooly's post explains a lot of the problems. Either lack of knowledge or just plain lazy. The question gets asked a lot about which broadheads shoot like field points. The fact is that almost all of them will if the bow is set up well enough. This may take time and few are willing to take that time. These are the days of instant gratification with no work involved. Life just doesn't work that way.

Thxs bfish and Ehunter, both of you are spot on. Like Ehunter it takes me just not hours, weeks and over time months to get the set up just right to include; arrow weight, spine, length and timing. If any one is reading this thread just take away what both Ehunter and bfish are saying here. Start by reading and asking questions. Every archer has his/her set up that feels and works for them.

bob cooly
09-14-2012, 04:01 AM
Actually it normally takes me about four hours, thats setting up the bow with sights, rest, peep, etc. If I can get it there at 20 yards in the back yard one trip to the range will have it there to 50 yards. I don't use any fancy lazer gadgets, just eyeball everthing in and use a small level. I've seen too many lazer dialed in bows that wouldn't group at 5 yards guys have brought to me.

bfisher
09-18-2012, 10:08 AM
Bob,

I;m much like you except that I can set up a bow to shoot and get it sighted in for 20 yards in about 2 hours. If I get lucky it broadhead tunes in another 15 minutes. It just depends on the bow and close things are initially. Once all that is done then it's tinker, tinker, tinker, tying to get that ultimate tune. I'd like to say it takes days, weeks, or months, but in all honestly I never quit till I change bows (every year) and then it's start all over again. LOL.

I know what I'm doing, but once I get it set up I'd have to prove what I did was worth the time and I'm not that good a shot any more. More than anything I am always trying to learn new tuning methods and learning what does what when I change something.

I remember when I got my 2004 SlayR. I put 9 different drop away rests on that bow over a period of two weeks just to see how each performed. Frankly I didn't like any of them. Ended up putting the Trophy Taker Spring Steel back on it.

Ehunter
09-18-2012, 04:11 PM
I also forgot to mention, I broadhead test EVERY arrow that I plan on using. Took a dozen new arrows out last night, and found that 2 of them didn't group as well as the others. I shot with both 3 and 4 bladed heads. Shuttle T Locks, Magnus Stingers, and Sanders Bloodshots. Both the 3 and 4 bladed heads hit in the exact smae spot as my FP's. at 30 yards. The two that wouldn't group as well will be for practice shooting only. Might tinker with them and see if I can get them to group better, but for now, practice only.

bob cooly
09-18-2012, 07:31 PM
Ehunter; my arrow building has eliminated most of the (out of the group) arrows by simply cutting and squaring both ends before I do anything else. Oh occasionly I'll get one that's only good if you want to make carbon straws, but not often. Everthing gets fletched on an Arizona Mini with Blazer vanes now. It's much like my handloading days I just don't put too many variables into the mix. Good Archery is largely a matter of consistancy and repeatability. KISS. The majority of us are excessive tinkerers and that brings it's own set of problems. Both my bows have the same sights and rests and pull 52-48lbs so switching bows is not a big deal. Again being consistant once you find what works is the key.

Ehunter
09-18-2012, 07:59 PM
Bob, I'm the same way. I'll spend hours and $$$$ finding out what works best for me, then I'll stick with it. Same arrows, same nocks, same fletch, square both ends, check everything several times. Just usually end up with one "flyer" out of a dozen. This time it was two. I am sure it's in the inserts, so not a big deal. I have over a dozen for season, so that'll be more than enough. lol

bob cooly
09-19-2012, 10:52 AM
Ehunter; I have the hours just not the $ anymore. Went out this morning and 420 grn Axis tipped with a Magnus 4 blade Buzzcut, shoots dead on to 50 yrds out of my 50lb Onza. Checked a 387 grain Goldtip with the same head and it shoots on using the next pin up to beyond my range to 60 yards. What arrow are you shooting? Going in tomarrow to pull my trail cameras out be before the season opens and to set up and ground blind.

Ehunter
09-19-2012, 05:44 PM
Bob, I'm shooting the Victory VAP's with pin nocks and a 350 spine. Magnus Stinger, Shuttle T Locks, and a Sanford Innovations heads. Found the Sanfords on Ebay pretty cheap, and they looked good so I bought a few. Really like the design and they are all stainless. They shoot as straight as any heads I have ever shot. Figured I might give them a try on deer this year, and see how they do. 4 blade, 1 1/8 cut.