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typically8
05-11-2013, 08:46 PM
Ok, can someone answer this question, why does martin use a straight cable guard rod? I noticed that there is very little vane clearance and if you look for an after market slide more then likely it will be to big and you will probably having vane contact.

bob cooly
05-11-2013, 09:16 PM
8; because they work. Bows are supposed to be simple, I've done the Bowtech Flexguard and other ones with rollers and am not impressed. I see you read my post on the Bengal. I always use a drop away rest (Ripcord) and I always fletch with my cockvane out away from the bow, gives me max clearance and even by moving the cables in maybe a 1/16" I still have clearance for Blazers or the 4" shieldcut feathers. After several hundred shots the Flexguard quit doing it's job and I am constantly fighting clearance issues, sweet shooting bow if I could just get a rod on it.

Sonny Thomas
05-12-2013, 07:18 AM
T8, basically it's simplicity. Straight rods work for everything, just not all that perfect. I have the steel offset guide rod on my Shadowcat and can adjust clearance as I so deem.

Just buried with the clean up after the recent flood I have yet to get with Canton Machining. I know Jack Iyman, the owner. Thoughts were to ask what it would take and how much it would cost to produce offset guide rods. From what I've seen of another marketing these the price is quite steep, like $45.00.
Surely stainless steel and simple bending process can't be all that expensive, but then packaging and shipping has to be figured. And then a certain amount of product has to be made to absorb set up costs.

Perhaps Joel could give us some imput....

Update; I just pulled up the Martin store, but for 2010. The Shadowcat offset guide rod is under $15.00. So people have to want and perhaps offset guide rods can be had for other bows.

joelc
05-13-2013, 10:28 AM
T8, basically it's simplicity. Straight rods work for everything, just not all that perfect. I have the steel offset guide rod on my Shadowcat and can adjust clearance as I so deem.

Just buried with the clean up after the recent flood I have yet to get with Canton Machining. I know Jack Iyman, the owner. Thoughts were to ask what it would take and how much it would cost to produce offset guide rods. From what I've seen of another marketing these the price is quite steep, like $45.00.
Surely stainless steel and simple bending process can't be all that expensive, but then packaging and shipping has to be figured. And then a certain amount of product has to be made to absorb set up costs.

Perhaps Joel could give us some imput....

Update; I just pulled up the Martin store, but for 2010. The Shadowcat offset guide rod is under $15.00. So people have to want and perhaps offset guide rods can be had for other bows.


If this was "JoelC Archery" I'd use bent steel rods. Straight rods work but offer no adjustability and they are more expensive. Go figure.

bfisher
05-13-2013, 10:38 AM
If this was "JoelC Archery" I'd use bent steel rods. Straight rods work but offer no adjustability and they are more expensive. Go figure.

Couldn't agree more. There's justification in having some adjustment. Why would the straight rods be more expensive? Because they are carbon?

To answer the OP's question, though, clearance is clearance. If vanes or feathers don't contact the cable(s) then that's all the clearance that's needed. Any more than that and all that's being done is creating excessive twisting of the limb forks and the resulting cam lean.

DeanRM
05-13-2013, 12:14 PM
+1 for "JoelC Archery"!!!

When can I place my first order...and do your bows come with a beer can holder?

joelc
05-13-2013, 12:31 PM
Couldn't agree more. There's justification in having some adjustment. Why would the straight rods be more expensive? Because they are carbon?


Yeah...it's a materials thing. The cost difference is very small but given the numbers we go through it could add up quickly.

joelc
05-13-2013, 12:31 PM
+1 for "JoelC Archery"!!!

When can I place my first order...and do your bows come with a beer can holder?

No, but the hats do!

bob cooly
05-13-2013, 07:10 PM
OK so I am HYJACKING this thread. Joel, Martin is for sale, right. Why don't the employees that know this company buy it?

dzsmith
05-14-2013, 05:42 AM
your joking right?

joelc
05-14-2013, 08:24 AM
OK so I am HYJACKING this thread. Joel, Martin is for sale, right. Why don't the employees that know this company buy it?

I'm lucky enough to be able to afford food, rent or gas money let alone the purchase of a company.

bfisher
05-14-2013, 09:57 AM
Bob,

One thing you may not be aware of is that all the archery companies I've been associated with over the several decades were not awash with employees nor employees with lots of money laying around. Joel might be able to give us an idea of how many employees Marin actually has.

joelc
05-14-2013, 10:23 AM
Bob,

One thing you may not be aware of is that all the archery companies I've been associated with over the several decades were not awash with employees nor employees with lots of money laying around. Joel might be able to give us an idea of how many employees Marin actually has.

Most are at minimum wage and we receive no benefits.

scepterman30x
05-14-2013, 11:38 AM
Most are at minimum wage and we receive no benefits.

Are you fricken serious!!! You would think at minimum wage you could at least get some benniies.

Sonny Thomas
05-14-2013, 02:34 PM
Yep, just about what I figured. Just like the small shop I work at. This is a archery shop only, no side line stuff. Business super slow and slowly closing the doors, I've been working the last two years for gas money and shooting privileges.

But retired, it helps pass the time of day.

typically8
05-14-2013, 05:32 PM
Where do I start with my response? I am going tp paraphrase all qoutes.
Bob says straight works and its simple
Sonny says straight works and bent is a cost issue
Joel says he prefers bent
Barry agrees w/ Joel but says any more clearance then needed causes cam lean, also he called me an OP (outwardly pink?)
I think he might have a sex bolt loose.
Joel then says it could be a cost issue

Then from there it goes crazy.

So, back to my point. If you use an after market slide you will probably have cleance issues. The need for an after market slide is due in part of someone putting a WHITE slide on a camo bow. I am currently using low profile vanes and have tried new slides but there is just no way I wont get contact. I guess I will try and steal a bent rod or paint the WHITE slide.
Thanks for all you comments.

P.S. if I could I would give y'all Martin employees a raise if I were the cheif.

bfisher
05-14-2013, 07:22 PM
OP= Original Poster. I was too lazy to scroll up and see who started the thread. I hope you didn't take offense.

Just one more suggestion. Have you tried Duravane LP-400 vanes> They are only 3/8" tall and are only 1 gr. heavier than a Blazer.

As for a white slide I don't see a problem. There isn't enough white to alert an animal. White usually tells me it's Teflon and Teflon is still the best material for a slide IMO. I'd rather have function than aesthetics.

Sonny Thomas
05-14-2013, 07:36 PM
T8,
You skipped over some info.

Barry! Or someone speak up. Who was the one who made his own bent and angled guide rod? There were pictures of it. Or I've been working too hard on the flood clean up and going brain dead.

wscywabbit
05-14-2013, 07:47 PM
I believe it was Hawgenvy (maybe?) that made his own bent rod... but that was a DIY tilt tamer, not for clearance issues.

Arrow Splitter
05-14-2013, 08:01 PM
I believe Rockyhud made one.

Found it:
Link---->http://martinarchery.com/mtechforum/showthread.php?9633-My-home-made-TRG-for-older-bows-%28like-my-08-Firecat-and-possibly-others%29

A.S

dzsmith
05-15-2013, 05:22 AM
Are you fricken serious!!! You would think at minimum wage you could at least get some benniies.

well i mean what do you expect man...a hobbie doesnt exactly win the bread. most archery shops where i live are sporting goods store and they depend on ammo sales and stuff like that to keep them afloat. the bowtech dealer in my town is a fishing charter, and opens his shop from 10-5 4 days a week. when i was stationed in florida while in the service, the man that ran the bow club which was striclty a range and pro shop was a retired man, who had been bowhunting his whole life, but being that is was his passion he reired then opened a bow shop. i would actually like to do something similar to this one day.

Sonny Thomas
05-15-2013, 09:33 AM
I believe it was Hawgenvy (maybe?) that made his own bent rod... but that was a DIY tilt tamer, not for clearance issues.

Yes, but just saying if a rod can be bent for this then a offset rod can be made.

Just wondering how much one should be offset and then for marketing purposes leave the rod ends long with instructions to cut to fit.

bfisher
05-15-2013, 09:41 AM
I guess someone will try experimenting, but I think the Nemisis will be a little harder to configure due to the bridged riser. There just isn't a lot of rod left behind the bridge. I might have to check mine out even though I don't have the problems some guys have.

typically8
05-15-2013, 04:45 PM
OP= Original Poster. I was too lazy to scroll up and see who started the thread. I hope you didn't take offense.

Just one more suggestion. Have you tried Duravane LP-400 vanes> They are only 3/8" tall and are only 1 gr. heavier than a Blazer.

As for a white slide I don't see a problem. There isn't enough white to alert an animal. White usually tells me it's Teflon and Teflon is still the best material for a slide IMO. I'd rather have function than aesthetics.

No Barry, my feelings aren't hurt. Right now I am using some vanetecs. Clearance is not a problem with these. It will be when I swap out for a new.slide due to the straight shaft. The reason why the white is an issue is because I spent MY money for MY bow with CLOAKED CAMS and there is this stupid bright white thing staring at me. If it were pink it would still be an issue. It means some one did not think first.

wscywabbit
05-15-2013, 05:19 PM
I know that Martin offers 2 slides, one white and one grey. I believe the white one is teflon and the other just a composite plastic. But the point is that there are two, and it seems to me that one is lower profile than the other (I seem to remember reading that in a thread somewhere)....