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flytier17
12-20-2008, 08:31 PM
Anybody used these? What do you think.

They use lift, like 3 mini aeroplane wings to spin the shaft, not drag. They have silent flight as well. And, they are fletched straight, and have no kicker like a quickspin. Aparrently they will spin the arrow more intensly than a quickspin with no drag. They are also stiff, so as not to distort at high speeds. Arrow trajectory is flatter too. @ 40yds, my FMJ's jumped an unbelievable 17" up, while @ 10 yds they were only 1.5" high. My pins are half as far apart, and the arrow weight is the same. Sounds like a plus for 3-D. Also, my 60yd groups went from 8" to 4.5". I like them a lot.

vision archery
12-20-2008, 09:08 PM
No I haven't but sounds like something I need to look into. Thanks for the info.

Joe

Montalaar
12-21-2008, 03:40 AM
Hey Alec. Give us some details, pictures, prices. :)

firenock
12-21-2008, 07:25 AM
Aerovane
http://www.firenock.com/Aerovane.htm

Aerovane II
http://forums.bowcountry.com/bcforums/showthread.php?t=20474&highlight=aerovane%2A

flytier17
12-21-2008, 11:49 AM
Hello Dorge, nice to see you over here as well. Welcome to the Martin Forum!

Like you can see in my post, I did get some Gen. 1 vanes from the AT classifieds. So far I am extremely impressed. I am holding out till the Gen. II comes out to buy more. I intend to have them adorning my 3-D arrows, as well as my hunting arrows if they can steer a Silver Flame correctly.

Montalaar
12-21-2008, 12:12 PM
Hey Alec. You are shooting Silver Flames? Great choice. ;)

bfisher
12-21-2008, 03:04 PM
OK Dorge,

I don't shoot vanes that often, usually because of the increased weight compared with feathers. However, I always like some new technology and don't dismiss it without having tried it for myself. I don't often ely on the inexperience of other to do my judging. So where can I buy a few of these things to try? I need the version that would be used mainly in 3D. Not interested in anything for broadheads at this time.

How might they work off a Trophy Taker Spring Steel?

For the record I've never shot Blazers. Not crazy about high profile.

Barry

flytier17
12-21-2008, 05:42 PM
Simon; I shoot Slick Tricks now. However, My FMJ's have only 7 that still fly right due to groups and RH's, and to get them to spine right, I had to cut them till they touched the rest. When i can afford to, I will be getting 2dz. FMJ's of the 300 spine, cut them much longer, wrap them, put Aerovanes on them, and get Silver Flames.

Barry; There is only one version, to be improved in januart with the Gen. II.

firenock
12-21-2008, 09:11 PM
I am still tweaking Aerovane II, if surface treatment and dimples pan out, You may be looking at a vane that is about 4.7 grains each with another 6% increase in spin! In am still doing more testing. Base on the current sample without the surface treatment, it flew the same as aerovane I with 30 grain penalty. i.e. after I added 30 grains to the arrow with aerovane II, it few the same as aerovane without any surface treatment applied yet! With surface treatment, alone, aerovane shows a 4 inches improvement over non treatment at 55 yards. And it also do another 5 inches (total 9 inches) improvement after we added the concave to reduce air to surface drag on the high pressure side (back side). If all is done right, Aerovane II should hit no less than 12 - 19 inches higher than Aerovane at 55 yards.

I am using the FC 1.3 on my arrow right now with FirstCut XT head (I like it even better than Silver Flame due to price and the bleeder. Can you believe it used to be about $15 for 3, and its blade is 0.058".

This is what Aerovane II should looks like.

What you see is FC1.3 (final candidate 1.0 revision 3), no surface treating has been done on it yet and all final smoothing and angular process have not been applied! And it is going to be about 5.9 grains each.

http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneII.jpg
http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneIILR.jpg

The picture is my setup which I took when I am on the stand at 4:04pm a few days ago.

http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneHunt.jpg

bfisher
12-22-2008, 08:58 AM
So what surface treating is it going to be and for what purpose? Also what's the height of the vane? I may or may not use a drop away rest. All depends.

firenock
12-22-2008, 10:39 AM
So what surface treating is it going to be and for what purpose? Also what's the height of the vane? I may or may not use a drop away rest. All depends.

It is going to be textures at 0.201 mm and 0.1005 mm roughness on various areas, then there is cross rips, dimples and mini hums to further create mini turbulence so no LARGE back pressure bubble can form.

The best way to describe this is via the dimples on golf ball, those dimples at rotational will create lift! The rips of feather of bird will give them the quietness and give the winds a little more lift too. That is why birds like owl have larger feather, but more texturized, while eagle although have super smooth winds top, but all tops of feather are ripped (reduce surface to air drag as the air is being disturbed, it cannot form uniform directional force against it, this is especially true in smaller flight surface). Texturing alone can add 30% in forward efficiency (decrease back pressure drag) as speed exceed 180 mph. The higher the speed, the more effective it gets.

The vane is EXACTLY 14 mm form the feet or 0.5511811" high

flytier17
12-22-2008, 02:52 PM
I am still tweaking Aerovane II, if surface treatment and dimples pan out, You may be looking at a vane that is about 4.7 grains each with another 6% increase in spin! In am still doing more testing. Base on the current sample without the surface treatment, it flew the same as aerovane I with 30 grain penalty. i.e. after I added 30 grains to the arrow with aerovane II, it few the same as aerovane without any surface treatment applied yet! With surface treatment, alone, aerovane shows a 4 inches improvement over non treatment at 55 yards. And it also do another 5 inches (total 9 inches) improvement after we added the concave to reduce air to surface drag on the high pressure side (back side). If all is done right, Aerovane II should hit no less than 12 - 19 inches higher than Aerovane at 55 yards.

I am using the FC 1.3 on my arrow right now with FirstCut XT head (I like it even better than Silver Flame due to price and the bleeder. Can you believe it used to be about $15 for 3, and its blade is 0.058".

This is what Aerovane II should looks like.

What you see is FC1.3 (final candidate 1.0 revision 3), no surface treating has been done on it yet and all final smoothing and angular process have not been applied! And it is going to be about 5.9 grains each.

http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneII.jpg
http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneIILR.jpg

The picture is my setup which I took when I am on the stand at 4:04pm a few days ago.

http://www.firenock.com/images/AerovaneHunt.jpg

EEEEK! I can't believe it! A picture of a Mahahahahahathews on the Martin Tech forum! Somebody BAN him!




































Just kidding Dorge, to each his own. At least its not a crossbow. Thanks for coming over here to give give us a little information on the Aerovane.

I was under the impression that the Aerovane II would be 10grs. each too. Boy am I glad to see that they will be a lot less. Now I can still have arrow wraps and bee @ 325grs. exactly which is perfect for my Cougar @ 64lbs.

Whatever happened to the "bi-delta" configuration? Why did you oust it?

So if the Areovane II impacts 12-19" higher that Aerovane I, How much higher on average will the Aerovane II be over a quickspin or helical fletch?

Alec

alex
12-22-2008, 03:33 PM
You are this "SOMEBODY" if i have understand corectly the "M" word under your name. ;)

flytier17
12-22-2008, 08:34 PM
True, I guess this can only further emphasize that I did not really want him banned as I could have done something about it myself.

Dorge is a great guy, and I for one am happy he can be here to help others overe here understand his innovative concept and design. I like the idea very much. I am eager to see how the experienced top-notch archers on here who have done a lot with vanes and fletches think of the idea.

firenock
12-22-2008, 09:05 PM
Sorry, I supposed to be shooting the z28, the had the wrong size send. That is why I am still shooting the DXT.

The aerovane and aerovane 2 have the same Reynolds number for the airfoil design. Aerovane look cool and it seems to work better for crossbow when weight is not that big of an issue. For speed bow aerovane 2 just flat out faster due to weight. In most cases, I believe any aerovane will out lift anything at 55 yds and beyond. The 2 factors that will make it different is material stiffness and spin. These will prevent the tip from dropping easily so it becomes a much flatter flight path. In most cases a 20 yd pin may become a 37 yd with aerovane 2. Which can be ridiculous if one have not seen it in real life? So 3D people is going go nuts on this, I believe.

Montalaar
12-23-2008, 03:34 AM
I believe i am interested....

Any chance to get some for free to try them out in old europe? ;)

bfisher
12-23-2008, 05:36 PM
I believe i am interested....

Any chance to get some for free to try them out in old europe? ;)

Can you believe this guy? First he tries to steal my dream. Now he's begging.


HaHa!!! Got ya Simon.

Montalaar
12-24-2008, 05:29 AM
@Bfisher

Hey.. YOU are a Martin Staff Shooter. That is something i will not be able to reach... :(


Edit:
And someone needs to try out if those Vanes have the same effect in europe also. :P

Edit:

AND i can promote them when i am shooting on torunaments. If i am convinced. :P

flytier17
12-24-2008, 11:58 AM
There you go Simon. You can be the official Aerovane rep in Europe. You need a fancy title like "Official Firenock/Aerovane Representative Staff Shooter of the Continent of Germany and Europe"!

Montalaar
12-24-2008, 01:10 PM
Would be a sweet thing if so. :P

bfisher
12-24-2008, 01:37 PM
Would be a sweet thing if so. :P

Seriously, you'd get my vote if it were up to me. And I'm particular.

flytier17
12-24-2008, 04:41 PM
Me too, cept I'm not as persnickety as bfisher or other old women...
























OOPS, Did I say that out loud:o

alex
12-25-2008, 03:49 AM
Can i be his deputy for the Balkans and Eastern Europe? :D

Montalaar
12-25-2008, 04:52 AM
Thanks Barry and Alec. Nice to hear that you trust me.. ;)

@Alex
Stop stealing my dream. :P

alex
12-25-2008, 08:49 AM
:p My dream is to open a pro shop here, no to work for somebody else :D :D :D

Montalaar
12-26-2008, 01:32 PM
It is just too sad that Dorge is not any longer active here and does not reply, eh?

firenock
12-30-2008, 08:20 PM
It is just too sad that Dorge is not any longer active here and does not reply, eh?

I am working hard to get Aerovane II out and preparing for ATA. So if you want to see Aerovane and all firenock, I shall be at booth 2609 on the 8th to the 10th.

Montalaar
02-20-2009, 05:35 AM
I just had to bump that.

Is there any chance to get Aerovanes II in Europe? I am very interested in trying these out and i found already someone else to join me. But we need a shop anywhere in europe.

firenock
03-03-2009, 10:13 PM
You need to contact contact@firenockintl.com and asked. They handle anything Firenock LLC in US got and have a ton more stuff that we cannot sell in US.

flytier17
03-05-2009, 06:10 PM
Can I get my Aerovane II's in colours other than white yet?

Alec

firenock
03-05-2009, 07:07 PM
Not till we have time to take a break due to Aerovane demand. Hopefully by mid April, we shall start to look at other colors of Aerovane II.

flytier17
03-05-2009, 07:25 PM
I need to get my CXL's fletched up by 3-D season. I may be shooting those Flex-Fletch FLP-300's for 3-D. When the Aerovane II comes out, I can give you a comparison on the Aerovane II Vs. The FLP-300 (an ideal 3-D vane for flat trajectory / low drag)

When will they be ready t order and ship? April? Or is that just the production stage.

firenock
03-05-2009, 07:33 PM
You need to give contact@firenockintll.com a shout as you are in Canada. You can order direct from them as Firenock LLC only sell to US except for 2 store that are grandfathered in. Aerovane II is available now in white.

brushrat
03-05-2009, 10:48 PM
how about some free samples ......need proof kemo-sobby!

firenock
03-06-2009, 06:07 AM
how about some free samples ......need proof kemo-sobby!

Free sample without the tool were given to Firenock orders that were place on the web store a while back (3 each without the tool); which do not work out as tool is an necessarity. We now only offer it in full retail pack or trail pack at ($6.00 with tool and shipping and handling).

http://shop.firenock.com