PDA

View Full Version : Stats for Scepterman30X's Shadowcat w/ cams?



scepterman30x
02-28-2010, 04:19 PM
Well folks those that know me know that I don't fudge, If I have to assume anything I will lean toward the conservative side or state it as is so here we go.

It came maxed at 67lbs. in the "#3" position. I'm sure the poundage would be higher as you go up in positions.

41.5" A/A with a 7.5" BH

My bow I belive has the 1.5 Hybrix cam and definatley has the Hybrix mods. It is orientated as it should be and the draw stop is set to 28.5" and the mod is in the #3 position. In that position it is at about 78% to 80% letoff (measured) and in the #4 position it is about 62% letoff (measured). Strangly enough it shoots better for me in the higher letoff position.
I know it would be the cats meow with about a 70% letoff but I would have to shorten the draw length a tad and I don't want to go there.

Set at 60 lbs
With a 495 gr. arrow: #3 pos=HL
High letoff=234 fps #4 pos=LL
Low letoff=237 fps

With a 354 grain arrow:
High letoff=271 fps
Low letoff=277 fps

All that is on the string is a D loop and a Fletcher True peep.

Using interpolation I calculate the actual IBO specs for my bow to be:

313 fps with the low letoff
307 fps with it at HL

20 fps for the difference between 60 and 70 lbs + 1 fps for the 4 grains over the IBO std 350 gr. arrow at 70 lbs. and the added 15 fps for the 1.5" draw length loss (std. is 30").

If I am forgeting anything let me know.

TXN
02-28-2010, 04:52 PM
Thanks for posting this, Scepterman. I'm a little curious about the 28.5 DL in the #3 position. Isn't the #3 position for 28 in DL? Can you set the drawstop past the DL position on the module? I guess I'm just not quite getting it.

scepterman30x
02-28-2010, 05:39 PM
One thing for sure is that DL specs are never accurate. They are just ball park (I'm strictly talking factory specs). They can vary 1" either way (usually longer). If I remove the draw stop the actual DL with the mod only in the #3 position will be about 29" (Martins norm from my experience). My stated DL specs are spot on accurate.

With my Scepters using the NOS cams I have to set the DL at about 28" because when I pull into the wall it will still go another 3/8" to 1/2" till I get to where the load is right for me. Since the Shadowcat has a truly solid wall setup is easier. "Set it and forget it"

TXN
02-28-2010, 07:45 PM
Thanks, I wasn't aware of that. I've just been assuming that the factory specs are correct and that the module positions would give a specific DL. I don't have a way to measure mine, so I've just been going by how it feels and it seems to be right on. Now that I know that they are not always accurate, I'll be interested in measuring mine to find out what it actually is. I'm still in the process of trying to figure out whether I can put long draw mods on it, so I suppose I'll get it all straightened out eventually.

XSpot
02-28-2010, 09:35 PM
I am Not saying Septersmans 30x finding are incorrect. I have been home with a broken nose and had nothing better to do. ( My Hunting bow blew up and socked my self in the nose and could not shoot in Vegas with a butter fly on my face.) I have been playing with cam rotation moving it forward a little to find a sweet spot. This may make thge draw a little long so i then twisted up the main string a little to bring the back into spec. I have been shooting this bow for a month now for outdoor spots . I am shooting at 55lbs @28.5 draw length, 70% lettoff withd-loop and peep. It is 41.5 ata and 7.5 brace height measured. The arrow 330 grn and chronos at 279 fps which also matches sight tape.
I turned the bow up to 60lbs at 28.5 in draw, the same lettoff. I grabbed a 300 grn arrow which is 5 grn per pound and chrono hits 305 and second shot hit 306.
The guy I shoot with came over. His shadowcat is a 70 pounder, and at 30in draw and with it set to shoot with peep and loop. 41.5 ATA 7in 9/16 brace height measured. With 350 grn arrow we got speeds of 314 @ 80% and at 65% got 319. This bow was smoken I wish I that kind of draw length.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 04:25 AM
How did you measure your and your friends "actual" draw length? Also I'm curious, does your cams look like mine and TXN or do yours more closely resemble a true CAT cam and what mod does yours have the HYBRIX or CAT mod?

This is just to be sure we are measuring "apples to apples".

Because if you are shooting even a little longer draw you will shoot faster. If you are shooting Cat mods instead Hybrix mods it will probably shoot a little faster and one thing we are still trying to figure out is what cams TXN and I have because I will assume the Cats will shoot a little faster than the Hybrix cams.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 05:59 AM
I am Not saying Septersmans 30x finding are incorrect. I have been home with a broken nose and had nothing better to do. ( My Hunting bow blew up and socked my self in the nose and could not shoot in Vegas with a butter fly on my face.) I have been playing with cam rotation moving it forward a little to find a sweet spot. This may make thge draw a little long so i then twisted up the main string a little to bring the back into spec. I have been shooting this bow for a month now for outdoor spots . I am shooting at 55lbs @28.5 draw length, 70% lettoff withd-loop and peep. It is 41.5 ata and 7.5 brace height measured. The arrow 330 grn and chronos at 279 fps which also matches sight tape. I turned the bow up to 60lbs at 28.5 in draw, the same lettoff. I grabbed a 300 grn arrow which is 5 grn per pound and chrono hits 305 and second shot hit 306.
The guy I shoot with came over. His shadowcat is a 70 pounder, and at 30in draw and with it set to shoot with peep and loop. 41.5 ATA 7in 9/16 brace height measured. With 350 grn arrow we got speeds of 314 @ 80% and at 65% got 319. This bow was smoken I wish I that kind of draw length.

If you do the math this is only 2 or 3 fps different than mine:

difference in loss of 5 lbs. of DW=10fps, then add back the difference between your 330 gr. arrow compared to my 354 gr. arrow (about 1 fps for every 5 grains (24 grain difference)=+5 fps so add the +5 fps to my 271 and that is 276 compared to your 279...not much difference if you ask me.

XSpot
03-01-2010, 09:46 AM
Hey thanks for info. All I am saying if you play with the cam rotation you can a get little more out of you bow. All this shows that are bow scales are close. I have a few scales and they vary plus or minus 4 pounds. My pro chrono is slower than Easton one at my local shop and the hand held modle is off by ten FPS. They are a bunch of variables. Yes your findings are close. I try to find a forgiving set up for spots. I hear Crackes can tweek the bow so you get about ten more feet per second.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 10:02 AM
My Chrono is a Pro Chrono also and with my cams you can't really over rotate them. If you do the lobe will push to much into the string. Thats why I believe I have the Hybrix 1.5 cam. Also I work for the State of Fl. and we certify scales using certified weights so I checked my Hanson hanging bow scale and it is pretty much spot on. The only varible that I may have is whether my Pro Chrono is spot on. I have been told they are one of the better ones out there so even if its not I'm sure its close.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 10:14 AM
One thing for sure is that DL specs are never accurate. They are just ball park (I'm strictly talking factory specs). They can vary 1" either way (usually longer). If I remove the draw stop the actual DL with the mod only in the #3 position will be about 29" (Martins norm from my experience). My stated DL specs are spot on accurate.

With my Scepters using the NOS cams I have to set the DL at about 28" because when I pull into the wall it will still go another 3/8" to 1/2" till I get to where the load is right for me. Since the Shadowcat has a truly solid wall setup is easier. "Set it and forget it"

Allow me to correct myself. "Never" should not have been used and I apologize. I should have said "The majority of the time from my experience". Some are pretty close to advertised but I have never had one that was spot. on

XSpot
03-01-2010, 05:06 PM
How did you measure your and your friends "actual" draw length? Also I'm curious, does your cams look like mine and TXN or do yours more closely resemble a true CAT cam and what mod does yours have the HYBRIX or CAT mod?

This is just to be sure we are measuring "apples to apples".

Because if you are shooting even a little longer draw you will shoot faster. If you are shooting Cat mods instead Hybrix mods it will probably shoot a little faster and one thing we are still trying to figure out is what cams TXN and I have because I will assume the Cats will shoot a little faster than the Hybrix cams.

We are both shooting 1.5 cat cam. I measure the draw length using the AMO standard. Measureing the deepest part of the handle to longest point of main string which on my bow reads exactly 26 3/4 I then add 1 3/4 to that number which gives 28.5. On my friends bow it reads 28.25 all measurements were taken off the bow at full draw on a hooter shooter. I worked as an archery shop manager for six years and set up many bows. I currently work for a machine shop as a inspector. I make all my bows dead on to spec. These bows out of the box were close to spec but a few twist here and there making the ATA perfect at 41.5 and the brace height just happens to fall into place.
I had a hard time with the set up when I first got the bow. It had way to much lett off. I am used to 65%. I set my stop to desired draw length. I then twist the main and cables to get 41.5 and the brace height came in at 7.5 on the button . I ended up with 60lbs on scale and 70% lett off. I then backed it off to 55lbs which is fun to shoot and it took some time to get used to the lettoff.
Today I shot a half of a feild round scoring 279 out of 280 possible. I need a little work.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 05:11 PM
What is a Hybrix Cat cam? I thought they were either Cat or Hybrix.

XSpot
03-01-2010, 05:57 PM
The cam reads cat 1.5 (no spilt yoke.) Do you want pics. Hey i dont want some sort of forum war. But this bow is sweet and Martin stuff is all new to me. I can help you get a solid wall with you NOS cams. It has been done before.

scepterman30x
03-01-2010, 07:23 PM
Oh there isn't much about a Nos cam that I don't know. However primarily with Elite limbed bows at 60 lb. max (with A cams) you will get a firm wall but nothing rock solid like the Cat or Hybrix. Put a Nos on a 13' or a 14" limb bow or one that is shorter and that is when it starts to be somewhat close to being "solid". Also the NOS B seems to be the most solid of the three. One way that I have noticed to get a more solid wall is to "build up the serving" that wraps around the mod (larger dia.) using a larger dia. serving thread or you could build the cables up or do both.

However I don't understand the "forum war" coment.

XSpot
03-01-2010, 07:45 PM
The guy I work with has a limb stop on his cam. Similar like on the new bows . It is a post on the cam when it rolls over and hits the limb and is solid as a rock.

scepterman30x
03-02-2010, 04:08 AM
Did he have to modify the cam to do so? A pic would be nice. I'm curious.