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duffy
06-28-2010, 10:43 AM
i have been using martin compounds over the past 6 months, and i have used some peoples bows - bengal, cheetah, tr2 and the moab i have decided on the firecat pro-x.

i have bought a 2nd martin bow and heard that if i wanted to get more consistency in my shooting I should get the same bow, so now i own 2 pro-x.

have i made the right choice as people within the club i belong have different compounds but not of the same bow!

i shoot field 3d targets, bowhunter

any advice/comments appreciated

Montalaar
06-28-2010, 10:47 AM
It is true that it is much more easier for you if both bows you own are the same. I always have two same bows just as a backup. Shooting differenct Compounds can be fun but might have an influence on your shooting as you have to deal with different riser geometries, ATA and so on.

bfisher
06-28-2010, 11:23 AM
I'd have to ask just how serious you are about competing in field archery. I've been that route many years ago. I also have a FireCat so can make a pretty objective opinion about this.

IMO, the FireCat with all it's virtues as a hunting/3D bow is not the choice I would make for field or serious 3D competition. The A2A is too short and the reflex of the riser allows for too much possibility of torque. Plus, for field you are shooting a known distance where speed is not necessary so I would want a smoother dual cam setup.

From a personal stand point I shoot around a 26.5" draw length so speed isn't something I'm going to get anyway so I don't worry about it. I also have an ability to, most of the time, be able to judge yardage fairly well. But even with my short draw I like a longer A2A bow just for it's better handling and aiming qualities. Something 36" or more. That leaves me with only a few choices in the Martin/Rytera lineup. So my obvious choice this year was an Alien Z with Hybrix 1.5 cams.

Being as I don't hunt any more I have little use for a short A2A bow. In fact, having shot one for a couple years now I still don't care for them. I quit on the idea of having an identical backup bow a few years ago. I rather like the idea of different bows for different venues. I don't mind the FireCat as a hunting bow where extreme accuracy is not totally necessary, but I like the way the Alien Z shoots a whole lot better for me.

I'm also not a big fan of single cam bows. I've shot them for nearly 10 years. Dual cams for 25 years prior. I like the dualies better. More adjustability all round. Besides, I can shoot about 8# less draw weight to get the same speed as the bows with single cams (Martins that is).

OK, a long dissertation from me to say a lot of nothing.

duffy
06-28-2010, 11:57 AM
I'd have to ask just how serious you are about competing in field archery. I've been that route many years ago. I also have a FireCat so can make a pretty objective opinion about this.

IMO, the FireCat with all it's virtues as a hunting/3D bow is not the choice I would make for field or serious 3D competition. The A2A is too short and the reflex of the riser allows for too much possibility of torque. Plus, for field you are shooting a known distance where speed is not necessary so I would want a smoother dual cam setup.

From a personal stand point I shoot around a 26.5" draw length so speed isn't something I'm going to get anyway so I don't worry about it. I also have an ability to, most of the time, be able to judge yardage fairly well. But even with my short draw I like a longer A2A bow just for it's better handling and aiming qualities. Something 36" or more. That leaves me with only a few choices in the Martin/Rytera lineup. So my obvious choice this year was an Alien Z with Hybrix 1.5 cams.

Being as I don't hunt any more I have little use for a short A2A bow. In fact, having shot one for a couple years now I still don't care for them. I quit on the idea of having an identical backup bow a few years ago. I rather like the idea of different bows for different venues. I don't mind the FireCat as a hunting bow where extreme accuracy is not totally necessary, but I like the way the Alien Z shoots a whole lot better for me.

I'm also not a big fan of single cam bows. I've shot them for nearly 10 years. Dual cams for 25 years prior. I like the dualies better. More adjustability all round. Besides, I can shoot about 8# less draw weight to get the same speed as the bows with single cams (Martins that is).

OK, a long dissertation from me to say a lot of nothing.


thanks for your reply b fisher

I am aware the firecat pro-x is a short a2a, but it was the bow out of all of them that felt good to me when i shot it, the 3d animal targets i shoot at are at unmarked distances ranging from 25-60 yards, some 3d animals shorter or longer depending on size. i myself have a 27" dl. my bows are 45-60lb so i know i can shoot 60lb with the agressive cams rather than go heavier in the bow to achieve the same speeds and i dont want to go heavier than 60lb.

so the duo cams arent dual cams (dual cams are where you have to have them in time at the same points)?

i have been doing archery for just under a year now and have finally settled on what i want to shoot and when from now on. (all i have done in this 1st year is constantly increase my poundage and change bows i started on a 20lb bow, now shoot wooden bows at 55lb and compounds at 60lb) my idea is. i will shoot compound bowhunter instinctive (off the fingers, people have different meanings for bowhunter in different parts of the world) for about half of the year, the other half of the year i will be shooting instinctive traditional, with border archery bows 2 takedowns and one 1piece. with the wooden bows i have also gone for same poundage and same height bows to again help me with becoming more consistent.

not sure how far i want to take my archery, but with what i said above about what bows i am now starting to use i hope i can start to beat other people at my club with plenty of practice to be put in.

bfisher
06-30-2010, 12:02 PM
Well Duffy, you have your own ideas and agenda and I'll certainly not criticise you for it. Heck, at least you have some idea of what you want.

I'm also aware that the Cat cams are not a dualie, but binary. I guess I have a tendency to refer to them as duals simply because they aren't single cams.

As such, my post was just for informational purposes. Something to maybe use in the future. I'm sure you certainly aren't going to go out and drop a big wad of bills for a longer A2A bow just on my say-so.

You have fun with your archery. And feel free to join in any threads that interest you. We get along pretty well on this site. Always lots of ideas floating around.

SonnyThomas
06-30-2010, 12:43 PM
I think you missed the point of what your shootin' buddies tried to get forth. The said general rule is one bow for paper targets and one bow for 3D. Having the same bow in a rather moot point.

I believe bfisher pretty much laid it on the line. The man is really good and you more or less blew him off.

As you can tell I'm not overly shy and laid back. I willing to bet if you stay in archery and really want to get serious, your "finally settled on what i want to shoot and when from now on" is going to change.

Finally, get a good target/3D magazine and look at the bows in the winner's circle. They ain't short by a long shot (no pun intended).

duffy
07-01-2010, 10:12 AM
I think you missed the point of what your shootin' buddies tried to get forth. The said general rule is one bow for paper targets and one bow for 3D. Having the same bow in a rather moot point.

I believe bfisher pretty much laid it on the line. The man is really good and you more or less blew him off.

As you can tell I'm not overly shy and laid back. I willing to bet if you stay in archery and really want to get serious, your "finally settled on what i want to shoot and when from now on" is going to change.

Finally, get a good target/3D magazine and look at the bows in the winner's circle. They ain't short by a long shot (no pun intended).



hi sonny

i dont think i blew bfisher off i just replied and said him what bows i have and what i want from my archery at the moment, i am aware this may change the longer i stay in archery, (i know i will have a more stable bow if i went for a longer a2a but as i cant hunt in the uk, i like the idea of having a short a2a bow and challenging myself to shoot it well instinctively, thats where the plenty of practice comes in)!!! i did buy the rytera alien x but there was a gap at one of the joins in the riser so sent it back and decided to get the 2nd pro-x as a back up bow, but as you said in a year i might change my mind and decide to do longbow/or something else. but at this time i am aiming to get more consistent with the bows i own and i have spent about 3000 on my bows so cant afford any new bows. lol

i have seen threads on here where bfisher has responded and he is obviously very experienced, i have even seen threads asking specifically for his help so i value his input into this conversation, remember everyone is on a different journey with their archery

what is the winners circle in a bow magazine?

alex
07-01-2010, 11:10 AM
3000 pounds for 2 firecats!?! As teenagers say: OMG! :D And i tought the prices here are awful...

duffy
07-01-2010, 01:22 PM
3000 pounds for 2 firecats!?! As teenagers say: OMG! :D And i tought the prices here are awful...

ha ha, i have 2 firecats, i have also bought 3 handmade traditional wooden bows from a guy in (scotland uk) thats for a different forum!!

alex
07-01-2010, 02:08 PM
That sounds better. Scotland - is it Border Archery? They are from Scotland as far as i know. The "handmade" explains the 3000 pounds. If we were in another forum i'd ask do you like them, but since we are here i won't ;)

SonnyThomas
07-01-2010, 02:15 PM
hi sonny, what is the winners circle in a bow magazine?

Winner's circle is a expression. It basically means the boys or girls in the top three of each class.

It is a rare feat for anyone to score high enough with a short ata bow to place in the top three. Here, the vast majority of those placing and winning have bows of 38 inches of ata or more. My shortest bow is 37 7/8" and my longest is 41 1/2".

To us, instinctively, means use of fingers and no sights. Here again and especially here, the longer ata bow is desired. Short ata bows pinch the fingers way too much.

I've heard bows and archery equipment over there are high priced, but if my conversion is correct, 3000 pounds = $4498.45, I could buy about 5 top end bows over here. Saying "You're getting ripped off" doesn't even begin to tell the story.

Wish you well in your archery events.

SonnyThomas
07-01-2010, 02:18 PM
hi sonny, what is the winners circle in a bow magazine?

Winner's circle is a expression. It basically means the boys or girls in the top three of each class.

It is a rare feat for anyone to score high enough with a short ata bow to place in the top three. Here, the vast majority of those placing and winning have bows of 38 inches of ata or more. My shortest bow is 37 7/8" and my longest is 41 1/2".

To us, instinctively, means use of fingers and no sights. Here again and especially here, the longer ata bow is desired. Short ata bows pinch the fingers way too much.

I've heard bows and archery equipment over there are high priced, but if my conversion is correct, 3000 pounds = $4498.45, I could buy about 5 top end bows over here. Saying "You're getting ripped off" doesn't even begin to tell the story.

Wish you well in your archery events.

By the way, beings your a hop and skip past the big pond, I'm writing this at 5:45 pm my time (central time, State of Illinois in the U.S.A.)

duffy
07-01-2010, 02:41 PM
That sounds better. Scotland - is it Border Archery? They are from Scotland as far as i know. The "handmade" explains the 3000 pounds. If we were in another forum i'd ask do you like them, but since we are here i won't ;)

certainly is border archery, but ill keep the chat about the bows with wheels

duffy
07-01-2010, 02:56 PM
Winner's circle is a expression. It basically means the boys or girls in the top three of each class.

It is a rare feat for anyone to score high enough with a short ata bow to place in the top three. Here, the vast majority of those placing and winning have bows of 38 inches of ata or more. My shortest bow is 37 7/8" and my longest is 41 1/2".

To us, instinctively, means use of fingers and no sights. Here again and especially here, the longer ata bow is desired. Short ata bows pinch the fingers way too much.

I've heard bows and archery equipment over there are high priced, but if my conversion is correct, 3000 pounds = $4498.45, I could buy about 5 top end bows over here. Saying "You're getting ripped off" doesn't even begin to tell the story.

Wish you well in your archery events.

By the way, beings your a hop and skip past the big pond, I'm writing this at 5:45 pm my time (central time, State of Illinois in the U.S.A.)



the price i mentioned was for 2 firecats priced at 400each, and 3 wooden bows around 800 each, so my maths was wrong 3200aprox.

i personally havent tried the longer a2a as thought the longer bows were mainly for target archery (that is the generalisation from the uk or at least my impression of it) i have a short draw of 27" and dont find finger pinch to be an issue, as i have said i am quite new to compounds and am on a steep learning curve, so fingers crossed i learn to shoot well with my martin bows, no going back now!! many people i meet on field shoots in the uk have got shorter a2a bows for instinctive shooting off the fingers and longer bows with a release aid and all the extras - maybe its a uk thing or just where i live.

im from essex in the uk about 30minutes south out of london

SonnyThomas
07-01-2010, 07:59 PM
My hunting bow, a Hoyt MagnaTec, has a 37 7/8" ata, the same as my target bow, a Hoyt ProElite. My 3D bow has a 38 1/2" ata. My other target bow, a Martin Shadowcat has a ata of 41 1/2".

Perhaps these links will help. You can see past magazines of Archery and a multitude of bows and helpful articles. NFAA website www.fieldarchery.com
John Dudley website www.dudleyarchery.info

duffy
07-02-2010, 01:51 AM
My hunting bow, a Hoyt MagnaTec, has a 37 7/8" ata, the same as my target bow, a Hoyt ProElite. My 3D bow has a 38 1/2" ata. My other target bow, a Martin Shadowcat has a ata of 41 1/2".

Perhaps these links will help. You can see past magazines of Archery and a multitude of bows and helpful articles. NFAA website www.fieldarchery.com
John Dudley website www.dudleyarchery.info


cheers for that sonny i will take a look, hope to talk with you on the forum again