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Thread: Got coffee? Bored, raining out? Read ramblings....

  1. #1
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    Default Got coffee? Bored, raining out? Read ramblings....

    Hi all and thanks bfisher for getting me into the club. Kind of like getting into an exclusive fraternity; thought someone had blackballed me for a week or so! Anyway, after about twenty years away from shooting a bow, and some minor heart problems; minor, I guess, I'm still alive, decided to get back into it as a personal hobby. So, knowing I'm a little weaker and a lot older now, and beings my last bow was an eighty pound pull, thought I'd best drop back from that quite a bit, so bought a seventy pound pull PSE Vendetta. Well, I can't pull that sucker anywhere near comfortably dropped back to sixty pounds! Then, a year or so later, come up with the bright idea of getting a highly adjustable, less expensive bow; PSE, of course, so I could start low and build back up, and their Rally would fit my bill so far as weight and length of pull adjustment; I have about a 32 inch draw but always shot an inch or so short of that for all the reasons a lot of people do/should. So, while searching for the right deal on a PSE Rally, I came across the Martin Fury XT cam. Then, while trying to decide between the two, PSE or Martin, happened upon your forum, which I've been lurking and studying on for a month or so now. Seems a nice lot, so I went with a 2012 model Martin Cougar with the Fury XT cam, which I've had now for a week or so, shot it a couple dozen times. Sure seems sweet shooting, quiet and fast; but that's compared to bows twenty, thirty years ago! Sure is a short little guy! I went with the Martin Cougar model because a friend of mine had a Martin Cougar 25 or 30 years ago and it was quite nice. They've changed some; only about half as long and did you notice the riser is no longer made of wood?!

    Anyway, because this may be the only thread I ever start here, I would like to ask some questions and, if I may, make some observations. You good folks won't have to put up with my ramblings much. I fear I have no 'expertise' to offer; more of a rank newbie, if anything.

    Questions, in no logical order;

    Need to replace the cable slide?

    Bow says it maxed out at 74 pounds; lowered to the minus 10 peg and the limb bolts backed out six turns, may i assume it could even go farther as there are several threads still showing below the barrel nuts? May I assume Martin's warning to not back the bolts out more than five turns does not apply here? (I don't need to go farther, but just wonder) And, ABOUT how much weight does each turn lower the poundage? (I'll measure that, for sure, if and when I ever find my bow scale again)

    The Fury XT is a 'true' single cam?

    Martin's 'seeming' problems with limbs was before the 'power tough' limbs on this bow?

    Useing my old under the jaw anchor point, my peep is seven and a half inchs above the center of my nock; need to change the way I anchor? (otisT, aka Harseface)

    Set on the minus 10 peg, at the longest (I Think) draw length, I have the draw stop set all the way to the plus side. Safe? Read somewhere on here about how cams can be over rotated. Sure leaves a short 'valley'. The draw is just ever so little short of perfect; I understand I'll gain a half inch or so draw length when I get 'er back on the standard peg, which should be about prefect, btw. Fear I'll still have the short valley. I do wonder what the let off is with such a short valley.

    This bow, most Martins, can be backed off enough with the limb bolts to be taken apart?

    May I assume dead flat 0 (center shot and nock setting) is where to start in tuning this bow?

    IF I have anymore questions, I won't bore you with ramblings! But, I'd still like to offer some observations;

    Bowmaster, love it, will NOT press PSE Vendetta, even with limb adapters (though they are 'completely field serviceable'!). Don't cut a string out in the brush, folks! Short hundred mile round trip to a bow shop for me anyway; I was/will be my bow mechanic. Part of the fun, imho. Bowmaster works great on Cougar. Which reminds me; Martin's 'bow manual' is about worthless, and they don't have any information on line, that I can find. Like, well, all the questions I've asked above; how does one know what the heck let off their bow is set at, ect. Their manual is so lacking, I'd compare it to PSE's!
    Put on 'Whisker biscuit' rest; don't hate it as bad as I thought I would, so far.
    Martin's 2X4 quiver looks neat! Ain't installed it yet, probably won't for a long time, but it's mounting is trick and will, I'm sure, work well. They might ought to mention in ads and such, it's only for Martins.
    Hammerhead strings seem very good; peep, with rubber, hasn't moved that I can tell and was put in before bow was shot at all; anybody else remember back when strings had to have stretch or they'd blow your bow up?

    One more rambling, then I'll quit boring you good folks; when I check in on your Martin forums, there are generally from 30 to 50 people. I think a lot, like me, are looking for answers but are shy about asking the questions. To them; if you have a question, join up and ask it; one or a dozen. In a month, I've pretty well concluded these good folks are more than willing to share knowledge; they're anxious to do so and are proud of their Martin addiction. "What are you smokng?!"....... "Ahhh, ahh, Martin... really smokes!"

    Thanks for your time, all;
    o

  2. #2
    Sonny Thomas
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    Default Got coffee? Bored, raining out? Read ramblings....

    First, welcome aboard. You weren't black balled, just on a waiting list.

    Read your Post. Whew! Glad you're not long winded like some of us

    The 2012 Cougar with Fury XT cam is a single cam bow. Top wheel just look funny the way it's designed.

    Yep, Martin went that new fangled aluminum. See them pretty wood riser bows once in a while. Yes, and short. When I returned to archery I thought they were over grown sling shots. Shortest bow I owned back then was a Fred Bear 60" recurve.

    Listed as 74 pounds? Well, not unheard of. I haven't played with the Fury XT cam, but literature says a range of 35 pounds. So we need some expert to explain how the cam is to be set.

    Of the letoff on most Martins back off the draw stop and fully draw so the cable lays flat in the module groove. You then set the draw stop to the limb and presto, 80% let off. Moving the draw towards the limb (tiny increments please) lessens letoff, shortens the valley (makes it want to take off fast) and slightly shortens draw length.

    Actually, you can change strings on Martins just by backing off the limb bolts. What you do is look through the barrel nut while backing off the limbs bolts. Back off ONLY until the limb bolt allows through hole is completely open. Don't back off farther and don't draw to fire! Here, the limbs are so relaxed you can use very little hand pressure to remove the strings - Please use care. I got picture somewhere in my messed up collection where I used a cut off carbon arrow - drew the bow string enough to rotate the cam so I could stick the cut off carbon arrow through the cam so when letting down the arrow held the cam and the bow string just goes completely limp.

    Present cable slide should be fine.

    So far the Power Tough limbs are holding up. I've about 15,000 shots on the Power Tough limbs of my 2011 Shadowcat.

    Seems you have a Pete Sheply anchor for the index release. Never cared for it myself. I anchor my first knuckle in the hollow behind my jaw and align my thumb length wise under my jaw. Sort of keeps my thumb from touching the barrel of index release.

    Lots of us have answers. We got answers for everything. However, correct answer cost more

    Ain't nobody smoking them wacky tobacacky cigarettes, but sure seems like something gots some...Well, gots lots of people in here following them little kitties around
    Last edited by Sonny Thomas; 04-14-2013 at 11:05 PM.

  3. #3
    Senior Member HawgEnvy's Avatar
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    welcome to the forum. since ST answered all your questions, I really have nothing to add since I haven't had any experience w the FXT cam. However,if you want to upgrade your cable slide,go with the Saunders Hyperglide. It's a pretty good little unit. And don't worry about not having any expertise. Just feel free to comment and harass people as you see fit. I'm sure you'll have more questions, eventually.
    '14 ChillR 28.5"/74# Extreme Recon sight,Schaffer Opposition rest,LS modular stab, Beman ICS Hunter 340

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    Senior Member wscywabbit's Avatar
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    Welcome to the forum! You'll love that Fury cam, it very versitile. Each peg drops peak weight about 10# and lenthens the draw by about 1/2", just FYI. Other than that, I think Sonny had everything else covered
    In God and guns we trust;
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    2011 Onza 3: 70#, 28.25 draw (AMO), 384 gr arrow, 288 fps
    2005 Saber: 70#, same arrow, 250 fps

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    Senior Member TEN RING's Avatar
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    nothing else to say but welcome to the forum,it only took a month for my activation
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  6. #6
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    Thanks for the welcome, guys.
    Sonny; I thought I warned you! "Got coffee? Bored, raining out? Read ramblings...."
    wscywabbit; I HOPE you mean dropping down a peg SHORTENS the draw length 1/2 inch. My understanding.
    My one point was that you can do a search for 'Fury XT' here or on Martin's site, or on the internet in general, and you'll come up with nothing. Martin's customers are left to learn how to set them and such on their own. 'Support your local dealer'; being in the neighboring town for a doctor's apt. anyway, went to my 'local dealer' for arrows a couple weeks ago; in the three or four dozen shots I've taken with Cougar, so far have only had four inserts come out. That's with just having three arrows up at a time. A Martin dealer, come to find out, but definitely not a Martin pusher. ICS hunter 340's, btw; think I'm over spined for the 45-50 pounds I'm pulling? lol

    anyway, thanks for the welcome and the information. o

  7. #7
    Senior Member wscywabbit's Avatar
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    LOL yes, sorry, I meant shorter. Got in a hurry I guess
    In God and guns we trust;
    • One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
    • A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


    2011 Onza 3: 70#, 28.25 draw (AMO), 384 gr arrow, 288 fps
    2005 Saber: 70#, same arrow, 250 fps

  8. #8
    Senior Member typically8's Avatar
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    Welcome to the forum otis T. I prefer to anchor at the cornor of my mouth as this is how I was taught. Use what ever is comfortable and will give you consistancy. I tried to change to a different slide but it was to big.and wanted the cables out of the way of the fletching. So far, i like my new fury cam so I cant comment to much. Remember, there are do dumb questions. Shoot straight!!
    2013 PANTERA w/ cloaked cams, PINK Meta peep, PINK/BROWN BSD strings, PINK/BROWN BowJax, Truglo Range Rover Pendulum Site, Shockwave Stabilizer
    2012 Onza III w/cloaked cams, Meta peep, Truglo Micro Brite, Shockwave Stabilizer
    2010 G5 Quest Primal
    True-Fire Hardcore and Winn Free Flight releases
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    Senior Member elkslayer4x5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by otisT View Post
    Thanks for the welcome, guys.
    Sonny; I thought I warned you! "Got coffee? Bored, raining out? Read ramblings...."
    wscywabbit; I HOPE you mean dropping down a peg SHORTENS the draw length 1/2 inch. My understanding.
    My one point was that you can do a search for 'Fury XT' here or on Martin's site, or on the internet in general, and you'll come up with nothing. Martin's customers are left to learn how to set them and such on their own. 'Support your local dealer'; being in the neighboring town for a doctor's apt. anyway, went to my 'local dealer' for arrows a couple weeks ago; in the three or four dozen shots I've taken with Cougar, so far have only had four inserts come out. That's with just having three arrows up at a time. A Martin dealer, come to find out, but definitely not a Martin pusher. ICS hunter 340's, btw; think I'm over spined for the 45-50 pounds I'm pulling? lol

    anyway, thanks for the welcome and the information. o
    Welome to the site! Post away, thats one of the ways we all learn here, and we're glad to help. Did you recover the inserts? Did the "local dealer" assemble the arrows? I prefer to use ferrule cement on my inserts, but others use super glue.
    http://eastoutfitter.tripod.com/index.html
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    Martin 06 Slayer, Nitrous C, shoot thru, 63lb, Quiktune 3000, HAA OL 5519, Beman ICS Hunter
    Martin 06 Slayer, Nitrous C, Shoot thru, 55lb, Quiktune 3000, HHA OL 5519 2X, Easton A/C/C
    Ben Pearson 1968 'Cougar' 62" 45#s @ 28" recurve, parallel shaft POC, Zwickey 'Eskimo' 2 blade

  10. #10
    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
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    Welcome to the forums, Otis. I'll try to expand on a couple things if I may. I have no experience with the XT cam, but past experience is what I go on.

    Your bow will reach 70# (74 if that's what the factory says). It's not uncommon for a bow to draw more than it's intended maximum so don't concern yourself with that. With the string connected to the standard peg it reaches maximum draw weight and draw length. Moving the string to the -10 post drops the weight by 10 lbs, but in doing so also reduces the draw length by an inch and another inch and 10# by going to the -20 peg. This also assumes you have the draw length module and draw stop set to the longest setting. This is how I understand it. Pulling things out of my pea brain it's much the same as wheely bows from decades ago where there were often 3 slots for the steel cables to sit in. Now I could be wrong so if I am I hope someone will clarify.

    As far as letoff goes they are rated for 80% at all the maximum settings mentioned above. Reducing the draw length using the -10 and -20 pins will usually reduce letoff but only by a few percent. There are several uses for the draw stop. One of them being to be able to fine tune the draw length. The other to be able to adjust for letoff. Big balancing act here. I prefer to set the module and draw top for my preferred drawlength. Then if I want to reduce letoff I leave the draw stop set for the length I want and move the module to the next longer setting. As you understand another important reason for the draw stop is to keep from over rotating the cam. If it's set too long you could possibly draw too far and lock the bow into a full draw position---not good.

    The reason for such a high peep location is because of your long draw and the shortness of the bow. It creates a very sharp string angle. If you're one of those people who have been accustomed to touching your nose to the string you're going to have a tough time finding anchor points because of the string angle. Personally I would question your draw length. Many people draw longer than what they should. Lack of experience or proper guidance are usually the reason. To shoot a properly fitted 32" draw you would have to be about 6'8" tall or have awfully long arms. Not knowing you this is pure speculation, but I'm just throwing this in for educational purposes.

    Reason you're losing inserts? Possibly the dealer didn't clean the inside of the shaft after cutting the arrows. The carbon dust has to be removed for any glue to bond to the arrow surface. I used 91% alcohol (not rubbing alcohol) and a Q-Tip. For glue I've always used tried and true 2 part 24 hour epoxy. Call me old school, but I've used various super glues with various results. Some dry and get too brittle. Yes, your 340 arrows might be on the stiff side at the weight you are shooting, but as you turn the weight up they should work better. I wold say somewhere up to 60# or a smidge more. You get closer to 65# or 70# you're going to need a 300 spine, but that's for the future.

    Anyway, take all the info you've gotten here and use what you will. If you have more questions please, I implore you, ask away. We on this forum are here to help others and are rarely bored. That's what we're here for. It's what we do.
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