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Thread: Paper tuning defined better!

  1. #1
    String builder/ Super Moderator Hutch~n~Son Archery's Avatar
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    Default Paper tuning defined better!

    I really like how George Paper tunes. Close your eyes to the H word in the beginning.
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    Hutch, on Dial Up. 7 minute video would take about 2 hours or more...So would you give a detailed account?
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    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
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    Good stuff here. George does know his stuff, and notice that he doesn't say a perfect hole is the end result, but just a preliminary setup to begin the REAL tuning process. I did learn something from this video. I never understood the process or purpose of yoke tuning. Now I do. The problem is that my Martin bows have no yoke--one of the reasons I'm still not completely sold on binary cams.

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    String builder/ Super Moderator Hutch~n~Son Archery's Avatar
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    Barry,
    I could not get my Bengal to paper tune at 3 feet to 9 feet and couldn't understand. Everyone tried to help but to no avail. Now I see the problem and am glad that I understand now.

    Hutch
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    Senior Member typically8's Avatar
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    This is no yoking matter. Seriously, all yokes aside; my Onza does not have any yokes. So what is a guy like me to do???
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    String builder/ Super Moderator Hutch~n~Son Archery's Avatar
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    Nothing at all t8 that is the nature of the cam!
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    Someone loan me $80 per month and I'll get satellite

    Wireless is $30, but they can't reach me. Closest is through Lewistown, my present Provider and only 8 miles away, 6 miles in a straight line. They have a sub sender or whatever you call it and only 1 mile away. Maybe, just maybe they could reach me if I put up a available 60 foot tower and a 10 foot section of stand pipe on top of it. We just plain sit too low down here in Poverty Valley
    Last edited by Sonny Thomas; 04-14-2014 at 08:28 AM.
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    Paper tuning; One step of tuning. Give me a tiny bit high and maybe a tiny right or left and I'm French Tuning and never look back.

    Yokes; I've used floating, static and no yokes.

    Floating yokes;
    I've had more floating yokes than all other static and yokeless. I've also placed and won with floating yokes more than all other static and yokeless. Didn't matter whether the game was 3D, Indoor, Outdoor or Field.

    Static yokes;
    Six of this and half dozen of that... Said for years was you untwisted and twist the yoke to remove cam lean, cam straight with the bow string and you were good to go... And that's exact what I did with what static yoke bows I owned. They flat got the job done.
    What this amounted to was removing additional cam lean to the cam lean from bow at rest to bow at full draw. Okay, cam is leaning and it gets worse at full draw. Yoke twisted up so cam is straight and at full draw you have cam lean. So X amount of cam lean regardless....

    No yokes, enter the Martin Shadowcats with atas of 41 1/2" and 41 1/4" and both with offset guide rods...If you have cam lean, you have cam lean. But with the long ata Shadowcats cam lean does not dramatically increase at full draw... These 3 Shadowcats I have wrote up here on the Martin Forums and most are lost, but these 3 Shadowcats were damned accurate. 2 were the bows I shot with my eyes closed and scored great on the NFAA 5 spot from 20 yards. 5s and 1 to 4 Xs, but with your eyes closed who the H___ cares?

    And to rattling off and not sure because I don't "yoke tune."

    What's took place in the last few years? Anti-torque rods, Tilt Tamer, flex guard rollers, offset rods, offset bent rods, bent rods and a company making rods specially for certain bows and let's not forget Martin's TRG... All are or are and was meant to do one thing, remove more cam lean or limit cam lean from bow at rest to bow fully drawn...

    Enter nuts&bolts/yoke tuning, he gives two examples, arrows taped to each side of the top cam and in his Nuts&Bolts of Archery he uses one arrow. Arrow (s) taped to each side of the top cam and yoke adjusted so the two arrows run parallel to the bow string. Guess where the arrow (s) are with bow at rest. I have yet to see him post a picture with the bow at rest with the arrows taped on each side of the cam..

    Side bare; Understand again, I don't "yoke tune" so I'm rattling.

    Continuing with above arrow (s) tape to the cam;
    So what's happened is the total error has been removed from cam straight with bow at rest to bow fully drawn and given to cam leaning opposite with bow at rest to cam straight with bow fully drawn. I call it trading 5 pennies for a nickel....Isn't then the string coming from straight to angled at the launch of the arrow? What's the difference with the string coming angled at full draw going to straight at the launch of the arrow? Heck, yes, this is confusing....

    And somewhere in Yoke tuning you play with your draw length, Creep tune and return to yoke tuning.
    Here, you guys read it; http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showth...post1068550613

    The day comes when I have to Yoke tune I'm quitting and taking up knitting...
    Last edited by Sonny Thomas; 04-14-2014 at 08:31 AM.
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    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
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    I get where you're coming from Sonny. How about instead of straightening the cam (yoke tuning?) at full draw OR at rest, why don't we compromise and do it at half draw? Split it all down the middle? I find it a bit confusing. Call me old school, but when bows were longer, cams smaller, and even 4 wheel compounds we didn't have these issues or at least it was so minimal that we didn't know about it. The shorter bows get the more acute the angle is from the cam/idler to the cable guard. Add to that the rediculous size cams are getting to be that are nothing more than a longer lever to exert a higher degree of twisting to the limb tips. I've said it before and I'll keep saying it. Limbs are designed to bend up and down; toward each other and not be twisted. Add twist to highly flexed limbs and I say this is a big contributing factor to limb failure.

    Of course, there are those of us who believe all the yoke tuning and such is not really necessary. Martin had they answer when the designed the "X" system. Too bad so many never saw it's virtues and simplicity.
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    Shorter ata, but with giant cams almost the same longer ata bows with smaller cams

    I know most in here don't get on other forums, but these monster big cams, they are collapsing, caving in. With reasonable cams, like Martin's Nitros or Hoy'ts original Cam&1/2, you just worried about a bearing or bent axle - this with a dry fire.

    You're right, Barry. Us ole long ata bow shooters didn't even think of cam lean. The wheels were so small you couldn't tell

    This yoke tuning...How is it called Yoke Tuning when all that was done was straighten the cam at full draw? Read the link above again, only 17 replies long. Maybe I missed something...

    Rock turner me; So I asked a person I respect. Hey, the man gets fixed broadheads to shoot with full scale target bows and he's cranking 310 fps and more.... Here was his reply; "Yoke Tuning ? well, sometimes it can make a difference, mostly not much. There's a lot to be said for not having a lot of cam lean, but beyond that, I've not seen a lot of significance.
    Best,"

    So I replied to see if "someone" will give a answer....
    Last edited by Sonny Thomas; 04-14-2014 at 11:45 AM.
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