Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 24

Thread: Light arrows

  1. #1
    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Middletown, Pa, USA
    Posts
    11,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Light arrows

    I am on a quest to get the best performance out of my FireCat for 3D, not hunting. I'm presently limited to about 45# so getting serious speed is kind of hard.

    Recently did some homework and came up with a good combination, or at least I think so. Having a 26.5" draw, all my arrows are overspined, the lightest being a 500 spine.

    I just got some Gold Tip Entrada 600 shafts and am playing. Cut to 25.5", 26" from the nock groove. The bare shaft weighs in at 145.4 grains. I'm using 35gr target tips with 10gr weights added. Add nock and three 2" feathers and the total arrow weight comes in at 209gr. That right, no misprint----209 grains.

    The FOC is pretty low at 5.83%, so I might have to play with that. Being a senior I don't have to shoot anything over 35 yards around here so it might pan out.

    Believe it or not these things still paper tune stiff, which isn't all that bad. I can always add weights to the tips and go up a few pounds in bow weight, trying to stay within the 5 gr/lb rule that so many like to adhere to.

    Haven't had a real chance to do any tuning or anything yet. Don't have indoor facilities as yet and it's been a might chilly out.

    My whole point is that for those who are not aware of it there are so many choices available in carbon arrows that it is possible to build ultralite arrows or ultra heavy ones, all spined correctly for your bow. In most cases you just aren't going to find these in archery shops.

    So who has any thoughts about my choice. Any help?
    If You're Not Living on the Edge You're Taking Up Too Much Space
    Martin Gold Plus Staff Shooter
    Alien Mafia
    PSAA Life member, UBP Life member
    PADI AOW Diver

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    bfisher,
    So at 45# staying with the 5/# rule your minimium would be 225gr. I am also experimenting with light arrows at this time and I am trying to adhere to it as well. I am waiting on some victory VForce HV 350s that are 6.4gpi and should weigh about 310-315gr. Is this rule explicitly stated in the manufacturers warrantee that if you shoot below 5gr/# that it will void it or is it a safety practice? As far as speed goes with your specs I would gues your still in the 285-290fps range. Thats not bad for 45#s if you ask me.
    2010 Alien X
    29"/70#
    353gr GT Velocity XT 400 @ 320fps
    370gr GT Velocity Hunter 300 @ 315fps
    Tru-Fire Hurricane Release
    NAP Apache Rest
    Black Gold AMP 3 pin sight
    Limbsaver stabilizer
    G5 Montec

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    What I could find is in the 2009 martin manual.

    Ten Commandments Of Archery Safety
    Never - Shoot an arrow that is less than five grains per pound. For example, an 80# bow requires a
    minimum of 400 grains of arrow weight. Less than five grains per pound of arrow weight
    simulates a dry fire effect and may damage your bow.

    and

    Warranty limitations are as follows:
    1. If bow shows signs of misuse, alteration, or mishandling this warranty will be void. Use of arrows weighingless than five (5) grains per pound of draw weight is considered misuse and will void this warranty.
    2010 Alien X
    29"/70#
    353gr GT Velocity XT 400 @ 320fps
    370gr GT Velocity Hunter 300 @ 315fps
    Tru-Fire Hurricane Release
    NAP Apache Rest
    Black Gold AMP 3 pin sight
    Limbsaver stabilizer
    G5 Montec

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    252
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    bfisher,

    I just ran your specs thru the 'Software for Archers' program I downloaded http://www.pinwheelsoftware.com/sfa.aspx
    Obviously you're below that 5gr/lb, but it did show that combo spined just slightly stiff. Program came up with 209.3gr (std GT nock), 7.36% FOC, 278.85fps

    FYI: up to a 20gr wt @ 43lbs, shows 9.19% FOC, 5.1gr/lb, and still 273fps
    2009 Martin Bengal M2 Pro Cam w/factory STS & CCS.....66lbs, 29" DL, 422gr @ 272fps, Winners Choice string/cable, Trophy Taker drop-away Rest, Scott Release
    1996 Martin Firecat XRG Pro Series w/Ultra Sonic wheels.....69lbs, 29" DL, 465gr @ 245fps, w/fingers & Martin leather glove

  5. #5
    RogerSr
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bfisher View Post
    I am on a quest to get the best performance out of my FireCat for 3D, not hunting. I'm presently limited to about 45# so getting serious speed is kind of hard.

    Recently did some homework and came up with a good combination, or at least I think so. Having a 26.5" draw, all my arrows are overspined, the lightest being a 500 spine.

    I just got some Gold Tip Entrada 600 shafts and am playing. Cut to 25.5", 26" from the nock groove. The bare shaft weighs in at 145.4 grains. I'm using 35gr target tips with 10gr weights added. Add nock and three 2" feathers and the total arrow weight comes in at 209gr. That right, no misprint----209 grains.

    The FOC is pretty low at 5.83%, so I might have to play with that. Being a senior I don't have to shoot anything over 35 yards around here so it might pan out.

    Believe it or not these things still paper tune stiff, which isn't all that bad. I can always add weights to the tips and go up a few pounds in bow weight, trying to stay within the 5 gr/lb rule that so many like to adhere to.

    Haven't had a real chance to do any tuning or anything yet. Don't have indoor facilities as yet and it's been a might chilly out.

    My whole point is that for those who are not aware of it there are so many choices available in carbon arrows that it is possible to build ultralite arrows or ultra heavy ones, all spined correctly for your bow. In most cases you just aren't going to find these in archery shops.

    So who has any thoughts about my choice. Any help?
    I have been using light arrows for some time now, I use GT ultralight 500
    for just about every thing at 28" to 29" with 80gr nibb, when I use them for hunting I use 100gr points, I also use Victory X ringer HV cut to 29"
    with 50gr point and 10gr weights, most of my hunting arrows have a total weight of 307gr, my hunting bow has a max of #51 they work fine for deer.

  6. #6
    SandSquid
    Guest

    Default

    I shoot Victory X-RingerHV.350's @ 6.2 gpi and 85 grain points and NanoForce 600's 5.4gpi w/ 85 grain points out of my 35# bows.. they are light and FAST.

    Shooting out of my 45# P3 and Scepter4 it feels borderline to a dryfire.

    Bumped the X-RingerHV.350's to inserts and 145grain field tips and the bows shoot soft and quiet, but slow arrows.

  7. #7
    RogerSr
    Guest

    Default

    My Victor X Ringer HV.350s are 28" with 50gr. tip & 10gr. weight for a total arrow weight of 262gr. and they are very fast. I also have some with 100gr. tip's that have a total arrow weight of 301gr.
    Last edited by RogerSr; 01-13-2010 at 09:34 AM.

  8. #8
    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Middletown, Pa, USA
    Posts
    11,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    So I see I'm not the only speed fanatic on here.

    For what it's worth I have shot light arrows since making the transition to carbon arrows back in the ealy 90's. Since then there have been dramatic changes in carbon arrows. The choices are almost endless if a person does some homework.

    Don't know why, but I've always been able to spine a little lighter than the charts show. I usually just pick something from Easton's Target chart to match up the spine.

    I can get a good tune with a 500 spine, 27" arrow, uo to about 63#. Depends on the bow and cam setup. Of course, the 60# is out of the question now. About the best I can do is 47# with any kind of control. I've just lived with what I have in the way of arrows and most fall well above the 5 gr/lb rule.

    With a new Alien Z on order I am finally opening the wallet and trying something closer to a proper spine and get the weight down at the same time. Last couple years I have been shooting GT UL-500, 22 series, and ACC 3-28. The ACC's are a bit heavy for my present weight, reducing speed, but as long as I've been shooting I've never found a more consistent, accurate arrow. Guys can say all they want about what carbon arrows are the best, but I don't think there are many that live up to spine consistancy any better than the ACC's; that is, without dropping something in the neighborhood of $400. Got to keep things within reason, you know.

    RLW, I thank you for the runout on the puter specs. I guess once this thing is set up I'll have to chrono it and see how close things are. That 209.3 gr is exactly what my powder scale says. I'll have to double check the FOC. I may have mismeasured or miscalculated. The only other thing I'm going to change with the arrows is going to CB bushings and G-nocks. Then I really have to get with optimizing the cam rotation as per instructions on AT.

    For those of you that experiment I'll say that's what this is. I can judge yardage fairly well out to 40 yards and do quite well with any bow shooting 250 fps and up. This is just one of those things to play with in the never ending quest for perfection. NOW, if I could ever get the target panic under control..........
    If You're Not Living on the Edge You're Taking Up Too Much Space
    Martin Gold Plus Staff Shooter
    Alien Mafia
    PSAA Life member, UBP Life member
    PADI AOW Diver

  9. #9
    Super Moderator bfisher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Middletown, Pa, USA
    Posts
    11,585
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SandSquid View Post
    I shoot Victory X-RingerHV.350's @ 6.2 gpi and 85 grain points and NanoForce 600's 5.4gpi w/ 85 grain points out of my 35# bows.. they are light and FAST.

    Shooting out of my 45# P3 and Scepter4 it feels borderline to a dryfire.

    Bumped the X-RingerHV.350's to inserts and 145grain field tips and the bows shoot soft and quiet, but slow arrows.
    Yes John, those vertical limbed bows do have a tendency to want to vibrate a bit don't they?

    How's that shoulder doing these days? By your postings I'd say you're not pushing it too hard. Good man.
    If You're Not Living on the Edge You're Taking Up Too Much Space
    Martin Gold Plus Staff Shooter
    Alien Mafia
    PSAA Life member, UBP Life member
    PADI AOW Diver

  10. #10
    DB_43725
    Guest

    Default bfisher

    If this is ov any interest Easten makes a ultra lite nok that is 2 grains lighter than the G nok. And they seem real consistant across the board.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •